One Ice Age or Many? – Mike Oard

[00:00:00] and now here’s your host Kevin conver bring your TI Bring Your shame welcome

[00:00:07] to educate for life I’m your host Kevin Conover my website is educate forlife.org a few weeks ago I I had on

[00:00:14] the radio Dr Jake Hebert we were covering uh he’s a physics he’s a physics um he has his Doctorate in

[00:00:20] physics and he’s talking about we were talking about climate change I thought I was important to keep talking about this

[00:00:25] because um whether you know it or not the the your view on climate change uh

[00:00:31] affects policies so the laws that are passed in our government here in America and really around the world are impacted

[00:00:37] by what your view is on climate change uh if if climate change is man-made then

[00:00:44] we need to restrict what’s happening right to to make sure that our world doesn’t go into a some sort of a natural

[00:00:50] catastrophe um on the other hand if it’s not man-made and there’s nothing we can do about it then um we don’t have to

[00:00:56] make all these restrictions with greenhouse gases and so forth my guest today is Mike Ard he’s a climatologist

[00:01:03] and he has a BS in atmospheric science from the University of Washington he has an MS from at in atmospheric science

[00:01:09] also from the University of Washington and he was a meteorologist from 1973 to 2001 for the National Weather Service he

[00:01:16] was the lead forecaster in Great Falls Montana from uh 1981 to 2001 so uh Mike

[00:01:23] thanks so much for being on the show today you’re welcome okay so um I want to read real quick before we hop into

[00:01:29] this this is from the Heritage Foundation and it says here this was an article published a few years back um

[00:01:35] regarding climate change it says the cost of a climate policy the economic impact of Obama’s climate action plan

[00:01:42] and this was back when Obama was um aggressively pursuing uh very restrictive um greenhouse gas emission

[00:01:50] uh policies and so forth and it says here this war on coal would prove the most costly with hundreds of thousands

[00:01:56] of of lost jobs and 1.47 trillion lost of national US income by 2030 and this

[00:02:05] is um people today are talking about this that you know uh president Trump has seems to be a pro Cole person versus

[00:02:14] or president versus um what Obama was pursuing um and so Mike what we want to

[00:02:21] get down to the bottom of here is is what’s the whole deal with climate change why do you have all these people aggressively uh pursuing things like the

[00:02:28] Paris agreement which Trump backed out of and and people saying that if you don’t believe in climate change you’re

[00:02:33] you don’t deserve to do science these sorts of uh things um we’re hoping that you can shed some light on these issues

[00:02:40] what got you interested in um in meteorology and so forth when you were young were you as a kid in elementary

[00:02:46] school were you like I want to grow up and be able to determine the weather oh yes uh right for Middle School I was

[00:02:53] interested in nature and uh and I grew up in sh Washington and the the know

[00:02:59] Reigns a lot and I was wondering why that happened so I I made my own wind

[00:03:04] Bane and anomer and uh had a rain gauge out there and and took temperature

[00:03:10] readings uh did my own observations for for a short while actually but that

[00:03:16] sparked my interest in um atmospheric science or meteorology there there’s

[00:03:21] differences but they’re about the same okay what’s the difference between atmospheric science and

[00:03:27] meteorology well meteorology focus is on forecasting well atmospheric science

[00:03:32] goes into the physics of uh weather and at the University of

[00:03:39] Washington was taught as atmospheric science which is actually a branch of physics called fluid dynamics so

[00:03:45] everything from about the minute you step in the door as an undergraduate uh

[00:03:51] courses in atmospheric science are taught with partial differential equations oh okay so that that for

[00:03:58] anybody who doesn’t like math then they’re going to have to back out of that huh oh yes it’s a surprise to a lot

[00:04:04] of people so you generally learn the theory behind the Motions of the of the wind which is uh by definition a fluid

[00:04:12] yeah that and that’s got to be really difficult uh um didn’t uh Jesus say we don’t know where the where the wind

[00:04:18] comes from or where it’s going yes uh he did you say something

[00:04:23] like that maybe at the time huh so um yes at the time we know more about it it of

[00:04:30] course yeah yeah now you work for uh are you currently on staff with Answers in Genesis is that

[00:04:35] right no oh I was I was actually um adjunct speaker for them for a few years

[00:04:43] okay and I’m I’m an independent researcher uh enjoying the Outback of

[00:04:50] the United States in bosan Montana and so I just do creation

[00:04:55] research now and I I I I speak now and then and but I’ve I’ve done research or

[00:05:01] speaking for all the major Creations groups in the past that’s fantastic okay

[00:05:07] now so um so when you got out of high school and did you grow up in a Christian family did you already have a

[00:05:13] Christian world view as you were moving into getting your degrees and so forth uh I’m not sure I grew up a

[00:05:20] Catholic but I was not a very good Catholic okay what I had 12 years of Catholic

[00:05:27] Education so uh I guess you might say it was a quasi Christian worldview okay and

[00:05:35] so what happened when you got to college and so forth and you started being you know you started um being confronted

[00:05:40] with the the different opposing World Views when it comes to looking at things like where we created or did we evolve a

[00:05:47] naturalistic explanation for um create nature and creation and reality versus

[00:05:53] um uh God divinely uh creating everything what happened uh when did you

[00:05:58] come to make the decision that hey I believe in the Bible well actually I wasn’t confronted

[00:06:05] much by evolution in college uh whatsoever because I was in a

[00:06:10] branch of physics that had absolutely nothing almost nothing to do with Evolution so by the time I got out of

[00:06:17] graduate school I was able to to I believe objectively uh take a look at it because

[00:06:24] it was controversial I heard about it read maybe a little bit about it um so

[00:06:30] and see if there was something to this Evolution I was thoroughly U prepared to be a theistic Evolution if the evidence

[00:06:36] for evolution was significant to my surprise it uh it was insignificant

[00:06:43] hardly any evidence for it and it really shocked me and it it actually perked my interest in no are and and I was about

[00:06:50] oh and so here I am wow wow that’s amazing huh so so you were expecting

[00:06:56] that there was going to be a lot of support for evolution but you ended up um going whoo wait a second there’s not the the the support that I thought there

[00:07:02] would be uh that’s correct now now um as you’re studying meteorology you’re

[00:07:08] living your life you’re moving along here um H how did this progress were there any kind of um spots where you

[00:07:15] you’re you’re St you’re doing your job just living your life and you began to look at meteorology and uh atmospheric

[00:07:22] science in light of scripture and the flood and these sorts of things when did that start to pop up in your

[00:07:28] life well I got I became interested in the especially interested in the issue

[00:07:34] when I read Henry Morris’s John Wickham and Henry Morris’s book The Genesis Flood a fellow forecaster actually in

[00:07:41] the Los Angeles forecast office uh gave me a copy of it to look at uh way back

[00:07:47] in the early 70s and uh that really perked my interest and I started reading more books and there weren’t very many

[00:07:53] books out at that time and then yeah by the time I got transferred to Bakersfield I and about three other guys

[00:08:00] uh were’re going around to various churches uh teaching about the issue of creation evolution in so not only did

[00:08:07] they peque your interest but they convinced you that this was the right this was the Right View yes and eventually I thought of how

[00:08:15] I can contribute to research and the Ice Age popped into my mind and so I did a

[00:08:21] lot of research on the ice age and that from there since the ice age is actually interdisciplinary and so that got me

[00:08:28] interested in geology physics so I’ve gone from climatology meteorology to the

[00:08:35] ice age to flood geology oh that’s very interesting well um my guest today is

[00:08:41] Mike or he’s a uh climatologist retired now but uh and meteorologist

[00:08:47] meteorologist uh worked for the National Weather Service uh lead forecaster in the Great Falls Montana area and uh

[00:08:53] we’re talking about climate change because um it’s not just an ivory Tower debate it’s something that really impacts our our world to to a large

[00:08:59] degree it impacts the legislation that’s passed the laws regarding you know uh what what kind of rigor a power plant

[00:09:06] has to go through how it has to uh limit its uh carbon dioxide uh emissions as

[00:09:12] well as cars and how how much carbon dioxide they’re allowed to put out and all these sorts of things and it has a

[00:09:19] huge financial impact on our nation that the amount of taxes we pay all these sorts of things so it’s important to

[00:09:25] understand that our our Viewpoint our Biblical viewpoint or lack thereof is going to make can impact on how we live

[00:09:31] our lives if we’re living life off-kilter from the truth then uh we’re going to be impacted negatively if we’re

[00:09:37] in line with scripture what in whatever we’re doing whether that’s relationships whether that’s our belief about climate change whether that’s our beliefs about

[00:09:45] um you know whether we evolved or didn’t evolve all these things have an impact on um the way we live our lives and uh

[00:09:52] Jesus Christ said the truth if you will know the truth and the truth will set you free build your life upon my word so

[00:09:58] when we get back we’re going to continue to talk to Mike Ward about um his views on climate change and what we should be

[00:10:05] concerned about and what we shouldn’t be concerned about we’ll be right back hi this is Jason Hall president of

[00:10:13] Team hom loans a branch of synergy One Lending I just want to take this opportunity to thank Kevin Conover for

[00:10:19] the profound impact he’s had on mine and my wife’s spiritual life as well as being an incredible teacher while our

[00:10:24] kids were his students his knowledge and passion have taught us all how important it is to be Defenders of our faith it’s

[00:10:30] our honor and privilege to support Kevin and his show it is our sincere hope and prayer that you will continue to learn

[00:10:36] to be Defenders of your faith through Kevin’s radio show and through his educate for Life teachings thank you

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[00:12:24] on thanks for listening today this is educate for life I’m your host Kevin Conover my websites educate forlife.org

[00:12:30] you can pick up a recording of this show and previous shows if you visit my website also we have a homeschool

[00:12:36] conference coming up August 4th and 5th uh Pam TBO Tim tibo’s mom is going to be speaking there she’s a homeschooled

[00:12:42] Pioneer 1982 she homeschooled all five of her kids they all went to college with scholarships and uh so she’s going

[00:12:49] to give us insight into homeschooling and encouragement and inspiration that’s August 4th and 5th at the Creation

[00:12:55] Museum here in San Diego California Santi uh area so uh my guess today’s mikee or Mike when we left off the last

[00:13:02] segment you said um that you had been participated in a lot of research you looked at it and said he how can I

[00:13:07] contribute to uh this this sort of thing what’s some of the U big research projects you’ve been involved in or some

[00:13:14] of the research that you uh did that kind of um shed some light on issues

[00:13:19] that maybe weren’t so clear in the past well I first of all in regard to

[00:13:26] the ice age that’s what I started on uh back in the 1970s uh I first of all read what other

[00:13:34] authors had said about it and some had said well the key to the Ice Age would

[00:13:40] be a post flood warm ocean and others felt that the uh

[00:13:46] volcanic ash and aerosols from the flood and from post flood volcanism would help cool of the earth and so these hint they

[00:13:54] never developed it any further than that but I put them together then developed a an ice age model uh

[00:14:02] starting with The Genesis Flood right after the flood caused by a warm ocean from Pole to

[00:14:07] Poland and uh top to bottom and that causes much more evaporation now you

[00:14:14] need water vapor U now Mike when you when you say top to bottom what do you mean by that top to bottom top of the

[00:14:21] ocean to the bottom of the ocean okay so it it the the warming started from the

[00:14:26] top and moved downward is that what you’re saying oh it was warm from the flood okay the mixing and all the hot

[00:14:35] water added from the pounds of the great deep and and meteorite impacts and

[00:14:41] vulcanism you would end up with a warm ocean After the flood and it would the mixing would end up being warm from pole

[00:14:49] to pole and top to bottom so when you say when you say a warm ocean how how

[00:14:54] much increase in in temperature are you talking about oh I started with there’s a lot of

[00:15:00] ways to heat it and so we can’t have it too hot or else a lot of the organisms we observe

[00:15:07] today would be dead okay so I use an average of 30 degrees Centigrade now

[00:15:12] that’s an average there’s some places it’ be cooler and some places warmer than that and it had to cool down to uh

[00:15:20] the current average ocean temperature today is 4 degrees Centigrade so in that process of cooling the ocean which is

[00:15:26] mostly by evaporation of water paper uh you you put a lot more water vapor in

[00:15:32] the atmosphere and it’s mainly at Mid high latitudes because it’s proportional sea surface temperature and the the big differences

[00:15:39] would be at Mid and high latitudes where today we have cool sea surface temperatures but after the flood we’d

[00:15:46] have warm and so the difference would be dramatic so the most evaporation would be at high and mid latitude oceans close

[00:15:54] to the Continental areas where the ice and snow accumulated mostly in storms

[00:16:00] but you have to keep cause a cooler continent too because all that warm uh water would warm the air too so that’s a

[00:16:07] factor in all this but volcanic ash and aerosols would reflect a lot of sunlight

[00:16:13] back to space cooling uh mainly the mid and high latitude Continental areas and

[00:16:19] it’ll keep it cool for the snow and ice to build up and so and you can even time

[00:16:25] this Ice Age which is seems surprising to a lot of people and it’s based on the cooling time of the ocean so giv some

[00:16:31] reasonable assumptions of the Ice Age I estimated the cooling time of the oceans

[00:16:37] uh down to what we have today and it’s about 700 years uh to cool down once it

[00:16:43] starts cooling down below a threshold the the ice starts to melt and it melts

[00:16:48] actually catastrophically uh as we have lots of evidence for for instance in the

[00:16:54] L Lake moua flood and other floods Ice Age floods around the earth so there’s

[00:17:01] rapid uh rapid cooling is what you said I’d be fairly rapid yes uh I

[00:17:09] estimated the cooling time based on the amount of uh the said it’s called a

[00:17:16] budget equation you add up all the heating terms subtract the cooling terms and you get a change in uh temperature

[00:17:22] change in time so if I I estimated 20° centigrade cooling for Ice Age maximum

[00:17:29] and then I uh the cool the main cooling term is um evaporation it’s a powerful

[00:17:35] cooling mechanism and then I solve for t uh temperature I mean excuse me uh time

[00:17:43] so I gave me a a time of 500 years to build the the ice and snow up to a

[00:17:48] maximum and and then it took about 200 years to melt so a 700 year Ice Age so

[00:17:55] all the observations we see of the Ice Age which are thousands of them on the surface of the Earth and need to be

[00:18:01] explained After the flood are explained by this model and the flood is the key to it okay so so walk me through this

[00:18:09] here real quick so Noah gets on the ark right he’s on it rains for 40 days and 40 nights and then he’s on for a period

[00:18:17] more what how much longer is he on the ark after that was he was like on for a whole year

[00:18:22] right about a whole year yes yeah and so he The Ark Lands he gets off and the

[00:18:28] waters are slowly going down what’s happening right now at that point with the Ice Age take me through the the next

[00:18:34] uh you know few centuries or so forth well day 150 is probably the peak of the flood

[00:18:42] and everything was flooded it was Global uh so after 150 days to day uh

[00:18:50] 371 the water goes down as the continents rise up out of the flood

[00:18:55] waters and as more and more land is exposed uh you start getting a cooling

[00:19:02] right away now the cool the majority of the cooling is in the poles is that right uh yes in an interior of mid uh

[00:19:11] latitude continents also uh it would cool pretty fast away from the warm

[00:19:16] water so you’d you’d have uh the cooling starting right away um and by the very

[00:19:22] end of the flood where we essentially arrive at the current topography and geography we have today

[00:19:29] uh you’re actually uh pretty cool in certain spots especially uh Central and

[00:19:35] Southeast Canada and places in Asia and so you’d start your Ice Age immediately

[00:19:42] but it it’d be in in favorable spots it wouldn’t be everywhere all at once because you still have that warm ocean

[00:19:48] water so places like uh wash Western Washington which is glaciated down to

[00:19:54] Olympia Washington uh you’d have that warm onshore flow for quite a while that would hold it up but you’d have heavy

[00:20:02] precept in the mountains much heavier than today and it’s heavy already today so you’d have a many mountains of the

[00:20:09] world would would start GLA right away especially at the higher altitudes and

[00:20:14] now the Ice Age would slowly expand uh from Canada down to the in the northern

[00:20:19] United States and from the higher mountains to the lower mountains and finally for Washington State you

[00:20:24] probably had a surge from Southwest British Columbia down probably over a

[00:20:30] lake south of ice probably surge down to Olympia to form the PED sound lobe of of

[00:20:36] the cordelan ice sheet okay now so when’s the peak of the ice age uh what

[00:20:43] what how far After the flood Noah’s off the off the ark the waters have dissipated uh they’ve gone off the

[00:20:49] continents they’re into the oceans what’s the peak of the Ice Age where you have the most snow and

[00:20:54] ice about 500 years 500 years After the flood After the flood ended and um and

[00:21:03] it I calculated an average snow depth about 22,300 ft in the Northern Hemisphere and

[00:21:09] about 4,000 ft over Antarctica okay and though the Greenland

[00:21:15] and Antarctic Ice Sheets continue to grow after when the other ice sheets are starting to melt like the ones over uh

[00:21:22] North America and the one over on Northwest Europe okay so 500 years it’s

[00:21:28] at its PE and then it begins to um the areas begin to melt you know some areas you said are

[00:21:33] still growing so what I’m interested in knowing about here is is what if you were to share this with a secularist or

[00:21:40] somebody who’s like we’ve got to stop the the climate warming um what would you say to them as to how to respond to

[00:21:48] what we’re seeing with the Paris agreement and these sorts of things um based on what you’ve just shared with us

[00:21:53] I’m I’m curious to know um your viewpoints on that so when we get back my guest is Mike or he’s very uh he’s a

[00:21:59] research scientist done tons of uh looking at uh climate change meteorology

[00:22:04] atmospheric uh sciences and uh really a well of information so stay with us

[00:22:09] we’re going to be right back and continue to talk about this bring I will bring my

[00:22:17] heart did you know that Denver Broncos quarterback Tim TBO was homeschooled along with all four of his siblings by

[00:22:24] his mom Pam TBO you’re invited to hear Pam share how to successfully educate

[00:22:29] your children with a Biblical worldview at San Diego County’s only homeschool conference Here Local experts as they

[00:22:37] give you the tools you’ll need to help you teach your children don’t miss the educate for Life homeschool conference

[00:22:43] Friday and Saturday August 4th and 5th presented by the creation and Earth History Museum in Santi featuring

[00:22:50] worship with Michael Sanchez of the voice well-known local Bible teacher and radio host Tom caner Pat Roy creator of

[00:22:57] the jonath Park creation Adventure Audio Drama Series and educate for life’s

[00:23:03] Kevin Conover learn more become an exhibitor or register online now at

[00:23:09] register educate forlife.com that’s register educate forlife.com hi this is

[00:23:16] Jason Hall president of Team Home Loans a branch of synergy1 lending I just want to take this opportunity to thank Kevin

[00:23:22] Conover for the profound impact he’s had on mine and my wife’s spiritual life as well as being an incredible teacher

[00:23:28] while our kids were his students his knowledge and passion have taught us all how important it is to be Defenders of

[00:23:33] our faith it’s our honor and privilege to support Kevin and his show it is our sincere hope and prayer that you will

[00:23:39] continue to learn to be Defenders of your faith through Kevin’s radio show and through his educate for Life

[00:23:44] teachings thank you Kevin from the hall family and team Home Loans this is

[00:23:50] throughout all ages Ministry with Joe and Stacy we would like to equip you to share the gospel with confidence in a

[00:23:56] Biblical and effective way we would like to teach you through the proclamation of the Gospel whether you’re the skeptic

[00:24:02] God who created you said that he has made himself known to you so that you are without excuse one onone evangelism

[00:24:09] how do you think you can get to heaven never really thought about it but I’ve always thought of you know doing good more information go throughout

[00:24:14] allages.com like us on Facebook or visit us at YouTube at throughout all ages

[00:24:22] it no more hiding no moreing I hear you call for tuning in to educate for life

[00:24:29] I’m your host Kevin Conover my website’s educate forlife.org if you like this show or if you just pick up in the

[00:24:35] middle of it and you didn’t get to hear all of it you can pick up a recording on my website you can also check us out on Facebook we’re also on um YouTube so uh

[00:24:43] Mike is not in studio with me here today but um many of my guests are and uh recently had on Dr J keber also to talk

[00:24:50] about this issue very interesting stuff also just recently had on um not too long ago Dr James tour one of the top 50

[00:24:57] scientists in the world uh talking about why evolution is not true also recently had on Dr J or Julie

[00:25:03] Don RN on video game addictions and uh screen time addictions and how they

[00:25:09] impact a person’s ability to have a relationship with the Lord and also to

[00:25:14] maintain uh the spiritual disciplines in order to help us walk with the Lord and and uh grow in our relationship with God

[00:25:21] so all kinds of interesting shows please check them out um Mike or is my guest today Mike uh when we left off on the

[00:25:27] last seg you were saying that um the peak of the Ice Age would have been about 500 years after the flood so um

[00:25:35] doing the math in my head uh what would that be that would be what what uh

[00:25:42] BC uh 3,800 years ago okay about 3,800

[00:25:49] years ago Moses comes on the scene 3,500 years ago so about 400 years after the

[00:25:54] peak of the The Ice Age Moses walks onto the scene is that right uh yes what you read about in Genesis

[00:26:01] about the Patriarchs and Moses probably occurred during the Ice Age wow and most

[00:26:07] people don’t have any idea about that so so would they have been a lot would the Middle East have been a lot colder at

[00:26:12] the time or or would that not have affected the Middle East so much oh yeah the uh the climate would be cooler

[00:26:19] everywhere it would be it it’d be a strange climate um uh you’d have cool Summers and Mild

[00:26:26] Winters uh so with little seasonal change at the beginning and then the seasonal change

[00:26:33] would increase more and uh Summers would actually get warmer and Winter’s colder

[00:26:38] um now that’s not intuitive most people would think well uh you would have colder colder Summers and colder Winters

[00:26:43] so why are you saying that you would have um you would have uh cooler Summers and milder

[00:26:49] Winters because there’s a lot of ways to heat the atmosphere especially by storms you the warm ocean water would cause the

[00:26:57] atmosphere to be warm especially over the oceans and then then you have all that

[00:27:03] latent heat from evap uh it evaporated from the ocean then it condenses and all that lat heat is added to the atmosphere

[00:27:10] so those two heating uh uh processes especially of occurring with storms

[00:27:16] would result in mild Winters and then and we have observations to to support this and that the animals and plants

[00:27:24] during the Ice Age uh showed evidence a mixing from cool climate animals and

[00:27:31] plants to warm climate a mixing which indicates a warm or mild winter

[00:27:36] depending on where you’re at and cool Summers now are you talking about you this is this is um in the strata of the

[00:27:44] earth you find this the the the fossil Rec no no the animals that lived during the Ice Age they found an Ice Age debris

[00:27:50] like woly mammoths and ch- to tigers and for instance you had hippos living in

[00:27:56] Northwest Europe there’s 100 locations in just England Southern England where you had hippo

[00:28:03] fossils mixed with reindeer and Woolly mmth fossils so uh uh by the way this is

[00:28:11] the rule uh with with animals and plants uh that you have this mixing of animals

[00:28:17] from from widely different climates uh together in Ice Age debris and so this

[00:28:23] this adds support to the the mild winners in the cool Summers it’s it’s

[00:28:30] called in in the geological literature disharmonious associations wow that’s very interesting

[00:28:36] huh I’ve never heard that before uh so that that that’s uh very very interesting okay so so we’re getting to

[00:28:43] the issue of climate change here and I’ve been told Dr Hebert told me that um

[00:28:48] secularists uh will tell you there’s been like 50 ice ages and these sorts of things and that uh you know here we are

[00:28:55] we’re we’re ruining the environment uh through our carbon emissions greenhouse

[00:29:00] gas emissions um how does a a world view based on the science that you’re sharing

[00:29:07] with us and and the biblical explanation how does that affect our response to things like the Paris agreement and uh

[00:29:14] climate change and carbon emissions and so forth and so on well first of all uh Genesis encourages to to take care of

[00:29:22] the garden that’s what he God said to Adam and Eve so that’s a principle we’re supposed to be stewards of creation but

[00:29:29] in order to be stewards of creation and as Christians we need to gather the facts first too many of us look on the

[00:29:36] internet and are persuaded by some article we need to get the facts first to make an informed decision and

[00:29:44] unfortunately on the internet and and the scientific literature we’re not getting all the facts uh because of the

[00:29:52] the the strong push for uh what they call climate change now uh it should be

[00:29:58] global warming um to get grants and to do research you got to uh accept the the

[00:30:04] the global warming uh consensus view supposedly even though there are thousands of scientists that disagree

[00:30:11] with this consensus and so to get grants you got and the public you got to be in

[00:30:16] favor of uh global warming that we need to act now and that man’s totally

[00:30:21] responsible for us so we’re getting a barrage of research reports I I read

[00:30:26] science and nature regular and it seems like almost any every issue has some U article on global warming you know I

[00:30:33] mean they have billions of dollars of research funds are going to crank out a lot of research in favor of it and so

[00:30:40] there’s a one-sided view on on on this issue in fact there’s a whole Journal

[00:30:45] dedicated just to to H global warming and that’s it’s called nature climate

[00:30:51] change uh so so where are they getting it wrong where are they what are they missing I mean we all have access to the

[00:30:57] same uh you know data the same science what are they

[00:31:02] missing I think they’re downplaying natural processes it is a fact that carbon

[00:31:09] dioxide and other greenhouse gases like Methane have been increasing uh and we know that the that

[00:31:16] these do cause warming the problem is we don’t know how much warming yeah I looked up uh I looked up a stat and it

[00:31:22] said that the in the past 100 years the the temperature of the Earth has increased by less than a degree

[00:31:28] um is that sound yeah it’s probably it’s close to one degree fahren yes it’s what we we’ve

[00:31:36] added since uh they they start the chart at 1880 so that’s one fact that we’ve

[00:31:42] warmed uh approximately one degree Fahrenheit but those temperature records

[00:31:48] I know for a fact uh are flawed because of different observations time uh

[00:31:53] different instruments uh relocation of the instrument shelter sparse data there’s all kinds of

[00:32:00] problems but you know mo they mostly got it out of there I mean they taken care of because they know about these thurban

[00:32:08] heat island effect is is a major uh they mostly got that out but they not not

[00:32:13] totally so we to make a case and some atmospheric scientists have made a case that possibly onethird of that one

[00:32:21] degree fite is is due to flaws in the in observation so but I generally assume

[00:32:27] yeah one degree that’s close enough but but when you think about it that is a very small number that’s all we’ve done

[00:32:34] and uh We’ve increased carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases uh

[00:32:40] approximately 60 to 65% in carbon dioxide equivalency

[00:32:45] units W interesting that is a term which means we’ve increased carbon dioxide 30 to 35%

[00:32:51] and if you add in other greenhouse gas gases like methane that adds another 30%

[00:32:58] in carbon dioxide equivalent to units so we can keep it all one unit so essentially we’ve increased greenhouse

[00:33:04] gas 60 65% and only got one degree Fahrenheit they run these computer

[00:33:09] models of climate Mike Mike I got to cut you off right there we’re coming up on a break here but uh when we come back

[00:33:16] we’re going to continue to talk Mike or about climate change uh he was a he’s a he was a meteorologist still at his

[00:33:21] meteorologist for the National Weather Service lead forecaster Great Falls Montana and we’re getting a different

[00:33:27] perspective on climate change we’ll be right

[00:33:35] back hi this is Jason Hall president of Team hom loans a branch of synergy1

[00:33:40] lending I just want to take this opportunity to thank Kevin Conover for the profound impact he’s had on mine and

[00:33:46] my wife’s spiritual life as well as being an incredible teacher while our kids were his students his knowledge and

[00:33:51] passion have taught us all how important it is to be Defenders of our faith it’s our honor and privilege to support Kevin

[00:33:57] and his show it is our sincere hope and prayer that you will continue to learn to be Defenders of your faith through

[00:34:02] Kevin’s radio show and through his educate for Life teachings thank you Kevin from the hall family and team Home

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[00:35:40] coffee.com there’s got to be [Music] more welcome to educate for life I’m

[00:35:46] your host Kevin Conover appreciate you being here with us today if you want to check out um our other shows you can go

[00:35:51] to our YouTube channel educate for life video we also podcast the show you can check that out uh just a reminder August

[00:35:58] 4th and 5th we do have a homeschool conference here in Santi California uh at the Creation Museum and uh we are

[00:36:04] going to have Pam tibo who is going to be our key speaker keynote speaker the mother of Tim tibo as well as Michael

[00:36:10] Sanchez uh from The Voice who is going to be um leading worship and a variety of other speakers to encourage you in

[00:36:17] your homeschool efforts so my guest today is Mike or Mike um to continue on

[00:36:22] where we left off talking about uh global warming and uh you were saying that we’ve increased a maximum of about

[00:36:28] a degree even though we’ve increased over 60% our our uh greenhouse gas emissions um so are people saying that

[00:36:37] this is going to lead to a worldwide catastrophe if we don’t stop this um I mean they’re spending millions and

[00:36:43] millions of dollars if not billions or or uh trying to eliminate you know uh

[00:36:49] using coal and power plants and all this stuff um what what why are they you know

[00:36:56] crying that this is such a big deal well it’s because um they run these

[00:37:02] uh computer simulations of the climate and they they double carbon

[00:37:08] dioxide in those simulations and see and leave all other variables the same and see what it does to the temperature

[00:37:15] there’s been many models U run and they they vary with the temperature increase

[00:37:21] of anywhere from 3 Dees fenhe to 11 degrees fenhe which the rain should tell you something about the these models

[00:37:28] aren’t all that accurate uh but n Nature’s run the

[00:37:34] experiment already I mean we’ve increased carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases to equivalency of 60

[00:37:41] 65% we’ve gotten about one degree Fahrenheit and you can actually make a

[00:37:47] case that’s less than that because of the problems and the observations yeah so if you double car the greenhouse

[00:37:54] gases you’re getting You’ get a temperature changeing Maybe um 1.3 1.5 Dees F and yet all those

[00:38:04] models they range from 3° to 11 degrees Fahrenheit are way too much warming and

[00:38:11] politicians and some atmospheric scientists and and and a lot of SC and

[00:38:18] most other scientists that don’t know much about computer models uh take these things verbatim say whoa we got a real

[00:38:24] huge problem we got to do something act now Etc what they don’t realize is that these climate simulations are flawed yeah and

[00:38:34] and so they’re expecting that if if the greenhouse gas emissions go up the Earth is going to warm all the ice ice is

[00:38:41] going to melt and then the temperature of the the ocean is going to be raised I’m sorry the the the uh level of the

[00:38:47] ocean is going to be raised by something like a foot or something is that what they’re thinking oh yeah depends on what

[00:38:53] happens to the Antarctic West Antarctic ice sheet and the Greenland ice sheet of course for sea level rise but they’re

[00:38:58] working on all these things and and every time you read something it’s dire uh uh mostly it’s exaggeration they

[00:39:06] don’t they don’t usually don’t tell you the good things that can occur from global warming um anyway um yeah they

[00:39:13] take these models seriously and I’ve worked with models all my life I even did a computer numerical computer model

[00:39:20] of the atmosphere uh for my master CIS and uh they’re flawed they they can’t

[00:39:26] get clouds right they can’t get solar and infrared radiation right they don’t have the snow aging effect right they don’t have ocean processes right so they

[00:39:33] have to estimate all these things in these models so they’re flawed uh so I go with what Nature’s

[00:39:41] done observations so we double carbon dioxide we’re going to raise the

[00:39:46] temperature maybe a degree and a half Fahrenheit uh but there’s another factor

[00:39:52] in all this that I haven’t mentioned yet is that in this temperature rise they they neglect natural

[00:39:59] processes uh for instance there’s a number of natural processes that cause a climate to cycle from warm to

[00:40:05] cold and effects on the Sun cause uh warming or cooling we know volcanic ash

[00:40:12] causes cooling but that’s only for a few uh years uh they neglect these and and they

[00:40:18] also neglect well they don’t entirely neglect but they downplay past climate

[00:40:24] changes like we had the little ice age from about, 1400 to about 1880 in which

[00:40:30] all the glaciers of the world Advanced uh the Tims River going through London England froze over regularly

[00:40:37] which is unheard of today so the little ice age was that was a time of minimum

[00:40:42] sunspots and so there’s a correlation with sunspots there before that we had the medieval warm period about the year

[00:40:49] 1000 which the Vikings uh uh inhabited Greenland and and uh and uh we had a lot

[00:40:57] of warmth in Europe and so forth and you can trace these mainly to effects on the

[00:41:02] sun and uh and you can draw a correlation with temperature carbon

[00:41:07] dioxide and um uh uh Sun effects sunspot activity

[00:41:15] yeah flare flare ups on the on the sun yeah the temperatures in the 20th

[00:41:21] century correlate more with effects on the Sun than they do with the increase in carbon dioxide so I it all up for for

[00:41:28] my research after 50 years is that that man is causing global warming uh but

[00:41:35] it’s less than 50% but there are natural processes that are in play that are causing more than

[00:41:42] 50% so I divided at 50% so we are responsible for a little bit so if we’re

[00:41:48] responsible say for 50% of the global warming it’s only been one degree then you down to a half a degree

[00:41:54] Fahrenheit and the way they talk at the Paris agreement the talks and all those

[00:41:59] that throw billions if not trillions of dollars at it and you might get maybe a

[00:42:06] tenth or two10 of a degree Fahrenheit uh cooler temperature so actually there’s

[00:42:11] not a lot we can really do about it but we can mitigate it and we can do more

[00:42:17] unbiased research that’s what I always uh push for more unbias research uh in this issue and get the

[00:42:24] facts first for those that are confused so so it’s interesting too so as far as

[00:42:32] the are the glaciers actually retreating so you know we had a you said the peak of the Ice Age was about 500 years after

[00:42:39] the flood and it’s been um has it been receding since then or I mean was there

[00:42:46] ice Before the Flood was there was there a lot of ice Before the Flood or was that just purely as a result of the

[00:42:52] flood and since then the ice has been retreating or are we just going through um kind of and downs in temperature ever

[00:42:58] since the flood well uh after the ice retreated um

[00:43:05] uh when it was melding Winters would become even colder than today because you have those ice sheets that are

[00:43:10] melding and they would cool the climate just from their existence but once they melted essentially get to the present

[00:43:17] climate arrive to the present climate but with slight oscillations in climate due to natural

[00:43:23] processes of the sun and the oceanic processes but if you want to talk about

[00:43:29] before the flood uh the evidence from the fossil record at high latitudes and

[00:43:35] other places mid latitudes is that that the climate was probably warmer uh uh

[00:43:41] than today before the flood because we have all this warm climate vegetation from pole to pole that is in the rocks

[00:43:48] and also warm climate animals at high latitude so the evidence is by far that it was it was pretty warm before the

[00:43:57] blood and therefore you probably very likely would not have any

[00:44:02] glaciers at all maybe if maybe isolated and mountain peaks but I doubt whether

[00:44:08] we had any and then so the flood changed the climate T about climate change the key climate changer and uh

[00:44:16] okay let’s let’s let’s pick up here when we come back we have one more segment to go my guest today is Mike or uh he is an

[00:44:22] expert in climate and specifically how the flood affected the climate and uh he

[00:44:28] is a Bible believing uh Christian who loves the Lord and uh so when we get back we’ll continue to look at this

[00:44:33] issue of climate change in light of a Biblical uh perspective we’ll be right

[00:44:38] [Music] back did you know that Denver Broncos quarterback Tim TBO was homeschooled

[00:44:45] along with all four of his siblings by his mom Pam TBO you’re invited to hear Pam share how to successfully educate

[00:44:53] your children with a Biblical worldview at San Diego County’s only homeschool conference hear local experts as they

[00:45:00] give you the tools you’ll need to help you teach your children don’t miss the educate forli homeschool conference

[00:45:06] Friday and Saturday August 4th and 5th presented by the creation and Earth History Museum in Santi featuring

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[00:45:21] the Jonathan Park creation Adventure Audio Drama Series and educate for life’s Kevin onover learn more become an

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[00:46:08] Marina across from SeaWorld 61922 2766 hi this is Jason Hall president of

[00:46:16] Team Home Loans a branch of synergy1 lending I just want to take this opportunity to thank Kevin Conover for

[00:46:21] the profound impact he’s had on mine and my wife’s spiritual life as well as being an incredible teacher while our

[00:46:27] kidss were his students his knowledge and passion have taught us all how important it is to be Defenders of our

[00:46:32] faith it’s our honor and privilege to support Kevin and his show it is our sincere hope and prayer that you will

[00:46:38] continue to learn to be Defenders of your faith through Kevin’s radio show and through his educate for Life

[00:46:43] teachings thank you Kevin from the hall family and team Home Loans I

[00:46:49] [Applause] will welcome to educate for life I’m

[00:46:55] your host Kevin Conover my educate forlife.org if you want to sign up for the classes that I have available for

[00:47:01] homeschool curriculum it’s all online you can go to join. educate forlife.org join. educate forlife.org and uh you’ll

[00:47:08] be able to sign up for the classes and uh take get it for a Bible credit it’s a fantastic way to equip your young person

[00:47:15] your and and yourself uh in the word of God and to be able to defend your faith uh it’s a complete apologetics

[00:47:22] curriculum my guest today is Mike or and Mike um a lot of this stuff you’re saying is amazing very interesting stuff

[00:47:28] um is there any books or resources that you have that um they could uh go check

[00:47:34] out do you have a website or anything like that uh yes I have a website uh it’s

[00:47:41] michael. org o

[00:47:47] d.net and michael. or. what oh ORS o r o d s.net

[00:47:57] net great okay michael. lords. and uh there they can they can look into all this uh information you’re sharing with

[00:48:04] us well some of it they can um the best book to get uh is my book Frozen in Time

[00:48:11] willly Mammoth the ice AIDS and the biblical key to their secrets for master Books Okay frozen in time that’s

[00:48:19] fantastic um yeah that that is uh pretty amazing so you were saying that before the flood there was um a more

[00:48:27] a tropical um like environment there were there was probably uh seasons and there was

[00:48:33] probably north south of temperature differences but they were probably very mild uh and with mild temperature

[00:48:41] differences you don’t have enough power to generate storms and uh uh so it was

[00:48:49] probably mild especially from the plant material and the fact that uh if you look at the coal which is a

[00:48:57] pre- flood vegetation we have 10 times the amount of carbon in in the coal approximately than we have in the

[00:49:03] biosphere today on on land so it was a lush Rich environment and these plants and trees

[00:49:12] being 10 times today would would be giving off water vapor called transpiration and so our water vapor

[00:49:19] would be much higher Before the Flood and that’s the chief Greenhouse

[00:49:25] Gast it causes 85 to 90% of the greenhouse effect is water vapor and

[00:49:31] more water vapor and so it all goes together was a a warm climate Lush

[00:49:37] vegetation so we got to tell uh we got to tell all the people that are involved in the climate change stuff that they’ve

[00:49:42] got to they’ve got to lessen the amount of water vapor in the air is what we got to do yes water vapor in fact it’s

[00:49:50] difficult to to get those right in the models the water vapor there’s a uh the

[00:49:56] water vapor so we just got to stop evaporation from the oceans and we should be good to

[00:50:02] go yeah be other ramifications yeah exactly yeah so it’s crazy but uh huh

[00:50:11] that’s very interesting what else what else uh is important that people don’t generally um understand about um climate

[00:50:18] and these sorts of things as it pertains to the flood and uh how it impacted um

[00:50:24] our climate and so forth

[00:50:30] well that’s that’s a tough question could you uh narrow it down yeah there’s

[00:50:35] a lot there to talk about um so when you’re doing your research and you look at these things and people are talking

[00:50:40] about the flood they’re talking about um how impacted thing you know things are talking about the melting of the

[00:50:46] glaciers and these sorts of things um when we look at what’s happening with

[00:50:51] our temperatures today and so forth and so on um how is the biblical worldview

[00:50:57] different than a secular worldview I I mean Dr Hebert told me that uh secularists believe there were 50 ice

[00:51:04] ages whereas we’re looking at and we’re saying there’s only one um what kind of science actually supports the biblical

[00:51:10] worldview over the secular worldview uh if you’re referring just to

[00:51:16] the Ice Age um the fact that we can account for the disharmonious

[00:51:23] associations uh we can also account for the millions of mammoths that live in

[00:51:28] Siberia and Alaska and the Yukon Territory in low lands that weren’t

[00:51:33] glaciated we can account for them because the the climate in those areas was much different than today it was uh

[00:51:40] mild Winters with uh lack of permafrost and it’d be a huge grassland

[00:51:46] a great environment for animals that can tolerate some cold yeah what about that

[00:51:51] what about the secularist who says yeah but we know from the ice cores it’s very clear to us that there has been multiple

[00:51:58] ice ages we can see it in the ice cores we can see these long ages in the ice cores oh okay that’s another study I

[00:52:06] have a whole book on that call uh from The Institute of creation research called the Frozen record um oh to boil

[00:52:13] it down into a few minutes um first of all in the Greenland light sheet you see evidence of only one ice age but in

[00:52:21] there the the the snow accumulation is is is high enough that you can show seasonal cycle

[00:52:27] at the top but because of the compression of the ice the seasonal Cycles become blurred and difficult to

[00:52:33] read and so when they claim they can see 100,000 years of Seasons down near the towards the bottom from the top to the

[00:52:40] bottom in an ice core uh they’re really picking up other factors that cause these oscillations like

[00:52:47] storms uh and even within storms you have oscillation so the idea you got 100,000 layers up

[00:52:54] there in Greenland uh is not true where they pick up multiple ice ages is in the green the Antarctic ice sheet but uh

[00:53:03] they have evidence for about seven of them there with their 50 and that is

[00:53:09] based mainly on assumptions they can’t uh do anul layers and Antarctic because it’s too dry I only get about one or two

[00:53:17] inches of precept at the top of it a year and that’s not good enough and blows around not good enough to pick up

[00:53:23] the annual layer so they they Wing It by assuming that those Wiggles in the variables down

[00:53:29] in ice core and Antarctica are correlated with cores in the deep sea

[00:53:35] and they’ve already dated those cores according to the malanovic or astronomical theory of the Ice Age that

[00:53:41] they assume which uh uh has periods of 100,000 years so they say each Ice Age

[00:53:47] is 100,000 years back to a million years and 40,000 before that those are two milanovich cycles all based on

[00:53:54] assumption and circular reasoning uh uh to do it and that’s where they get

[00:53:59] the multiple ice ages from from antartic ice sheet wow well there there is a lot

[00:54:06] to uh learn here as far as uh this is concerned uh my guest today is Mike or Mike I just want to thank you so much

[00:54:12] for being on the show today I really appreciate it you’re welcome and his website is michael. or.net that’s

[00:54:19] michael. ords o d s.net you can check out his website he’s got all kinds of uh

[00:54:25] information there also um you can pick up his book The Frozen record what was the other book you mentioned

[00:54:31] Mike um the one that’s you said most one from Institute creation research on the

[00:54:37] Antarctic Greenland ice sheets and Ice cores that is still in print and the other is Frozen in time which is about

[00:54:43] William Amison the Ice Age okay so you got frozen in time and the Frozen record

[00:54:49] right okay great and um okay and are you ongoing and doing

[00:54:54] research or are you are you kind of uh just retired now oh I’ve been retired quite a while

[00:55:01] but only from the National Weather Service otherwise I’m a full-time creation researcher that’s fantastic and

[00:55:07] do you have your research listed on your website uh no I don’t can can people

[00:55:14] access that research at all um yes I I publish a lot in the Journal of creation

[00:55:21] and the creation research Society quarterly and those are those are the

[00:55:26] in-depth journals that we published or or or two of them I should say that we published and in creation magazine uh so

[00:55:34] I got a lot of articles in there that people can access on Ice AGS and the

[00:55:41] flood and even on on global warming well thank you so much for all that you do I

[00:55:46] I uh it’s an invaluable resource and uh absolutely making a difference so thank you very much for that Michael and um if

[00:55:52] you uh like Today’s Show please check it out share it with a friend you can share it on YouTube or podcast we’re going to

[00:55:59] be back next week uh with another special guest so uh we’ll see you next Saturday hope you have a fantastic

[00:56:05] Saturday stay cool if you’re here in San Diego it’s pretty hot over 100 degrees right now but um we will see you next

[00:56:11] week God bless you uh build your life Upon Jesus Christ and his word did you miss part of today’s program don’t worry

[00:56:18] we’re committed to helping you get the info you need okay that was dumb but for real visit educate forlife.com for

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