Defending Christianity Against Atheism and Evolution with Larry Blythe from Apologia

[00:00:00] hi my name is Kevin Conover and we’re broadcasting down here in Southern California we’re on locally on K praise

[00:00:07] kprz 1210 a.m. we’re also on FM 106.1 in North County and my show is called

[00:00:13] educate for life that’s my Ministry and my organization you can check us out at educate forlife.org and we’re going to

[00:00:20] be talking a lot about um atheism and evolution this evening here’s some quick facts the highest percentage of

[00:00:26] Christians in the world is in America but that number is declining if you’ve followed this trend at all Christianity

[00:00:33] experienced a 20th Century High of 91% of the total population in America in

[00:00:39] 1976 this declined to 73.7% by 2016 and then

[00:00:45] 64% in 2022 it looks like it’s actually speeding up now where do people go when

[00:00:51] they leave Christianity they don’t typically join other religions in America they become what are known as nuns or none of the above between 1972

[00:00:59] and 1991 the share of Americans who claimed no religious affiliation Rose

[00:01:04] just 1.2% that’s not very much at all 1972 to 1991 not much change the next 19 years

[00:01:12] though uh that increase changed dramatically there were about 6% of the sample in 1991 in 1994 it jumped to 9%

[00:01:21] and then in 2000 it was 14% 2010 18% and in the most recent data the nuns are

[00:01:28] just about 20 9% so about a five-fold increase in 30 years three decades and

[00:01:35] so to discuss this with me today is uh my guest Larry blly he earned his ma in

[00:01:41] apologetics from Southern Evangelical Seminary he was a regular speaker at the national Christian Apologetics

[00:01:46] Conference and the spiritual counterfeits conference he was an instructor of world religions and new religious movements and church history

[00:01:52] at Southern Evangelical Bible College and he was a regular guest on the weekly

[00:01:58] radio program The Voice of Truth uh he started apologia Academia now apologia live online classes in the fall

[00:02:04] of 2009 you can check that out at apologia.com and his real claim to fame is that he

[00:02:11] enjoys competitive pickle ball and he’s a certified Pro coach Larry thanks for

[00:02:17] being with us this evening thank you appreciate that hey I didn’t know you played pickle ball yes I do I eat sleep

[00:02:24] and drink pickle ball pretty much wow that’s awesome that’s fantastic long

[00:02:30] people didn’t know what it was yeah now now it seems like everybody knows what it was everybody what knows what it is

[00:02:35] it’s pretty awesome um well that’s cool so um you know what do you think of

[00:02:40] these stats uh you know this this CH is that accurate what I was reading off

[00:02:46] there that what I’m reading is that is there a trend towards more and more people becoming uh non-believers

[00:02:51] becoming agnostic well yes I mean I often joke that we need to start having people send missionaries to the United

[00:02:58] States now yeah so you know it might be a fat it might be you know that the

[00:03:05] Christian Church of course uh has taking a bit of a dive and isn’t doing their job and they they will you know who who

[00:03:12] knows uh the heart of the king’s in the hand of the Lord and so we just keep doing what we’re supposed to be doing

[00:03:18] not find new things just keep doing what we we’ve been instructed to do in the scriptures but yeah we’re in a post I

[00:03:25] would agree you know we’re in a postchristian society but that really shouldn’t make us

[00:03:30] rethink everything just if we would just do the basics this Christianity really

[00:03:37] isn’t doing the basics so tell us what is the what are the basics what when you say that what do you mean uh well one of

[00:03:45] the things that I teach my students is that you can boil everything down really to two things to know God and to make

[00:03:52] him known so if you want it really simple know God and make him known and

[00:03:58] so we should be making him known regardless of what’s Happening politically

[00:04:03] medically on and on uh we should be about the Master’s business by um

[00:04:10] strengthening Christians and teaching them and by uh going out in the byways

[00:04:15] and highways and compelling them to come in and do you think so do you think that Christian leadership in in America could

[00:04:22] do a better job of that is that what you’re saying no well that’s a whole another uh show uh absolutely yeah

[00:04:30] um sometimes it’s very disappointing to see what’s happening in churches and then there’s some great uh illustrations

[00:04:37] of churches doing a great job I mean church I go to so uh yeah it’s it’s

[00:04:42] bittersweet but uh we’ve seen a lot of decline in uh people really presenting

[00:04:50] the Gospel of Jesus Christ and uh going out there and sharing these things they

[00:04:57] get hit they get hit with issu isues and then they don’t know what to do and then they’re scared off that’s why Greg kok

[00:05:03] wrote the book tactics which is fabulous to help with that Fear Factor and so

[00:05:09] people are just as Christians uh as a whole I know I’m speaking in generalities but are just not doing

[00:05:15] their their job of making him known so people aren’t equipped to be able to do

[00:05:20] that as well as they should be like you said I think um we’re we live in a culture that’s become increasingly skeptical um because of the access to

[00:05:27] the internet and every every uh Schmo out there can put up their opinions

[00:05:32] about what they think without any credentials or whatever it’s and and so there I think a lot of people are being

[00:05:39] exposed to ideas they were never exposed to in the past that um are then being used like I I can’t believe it but

[00:05:45] people are still bringing up this idea about that was prop uh proposed in The Da Vinci Code um and I’m just like do

[00:05:53] you realize that this is you know first of all it was never meant to be uh factually based and second of all it is

[00:05:59] completely debunked it’s silly but yet it continues to to be uh you know put out there as evidence that the Bible’s

[00:06:06] not true yeah oh yeah well I was skeptical about The Da Vinci Code

[00:06:12] talking about skepticism yeah yeah yeah yeah you’re right yeah that’s a lot there’s there have been a lot of things

[00:06:18] that have caused uh Christians to uh step away Fall Away um and I know that’s

[00:06:24] a whole another topic as well as to why they’re doing that but with teenagers up

[00:06:30] to 80% of our youth are leaving the church after high school and it’s because of

[00:06:37] rabidly anti-christian professors who are uh

[00:06:43] teaching students things that they’re not prepared to handle and that’s why I love teaching apologetics in our live

[00:06:49] online classes and elsewhere because they need to be equipped and I have

[00:06:54] students email me all the time both with with creation against Darwin Evolution

[00:07:00] and just general apologetics where they have been defending the faith I had one student who went to a uh Museum I won’t

[00:07:09] I won’t say the name of the museum you could guess but uh and he started taking on the guy who was telling them all

[00:07:17] about these ape men and all this stuff and he started saying well wait a minute do any of these exist

[00:07:24] anywhere and the guy said well yeah and he goes well these this is just artist concep s that’s not really so he was

[00:07:31] going on as what he was taught and the guy finally says I’m just reading what I

[00:07:36] was told to here and he he got in class and said I was so disappointed because I

[00:07:42] wanted you know an argument but the guy the guy was just hired last week and they just gave him a a script to follow

[00:07:47] right a script yeah yeah and so you know uh up to 80% walk away from the faith

[00:07:53] now I believe the homeschool movement is putting a in that uh because that comes from two or three different

[00:07:59] different sources over the years but I I believe homeschooling is actually putting a in that because uh we

[00:08:06] are able to we homeschool families uh are able to do more of a concentrated

[00:08:11] training before all that garbage gets into the head of the students but they still need to be equipped more

[00:08:18] effectively to go to college when a professor says oh the Bible’s not true or Evolution has been proved you go wait

[00:08:25] a minute Evolution really isn’t even a good theory in in fact it’s at at best

[00:08:31] it’s an unsubstantiated hypothesis you know I’m sorry that you hate the idea of God Mr evolutionist I’m

[00:08:39] you know I’m sorry about that but your theory is really bad I’d rather believe

[00:08:45] in some Timeless spaceless immaterial being than your silliness I mean it’s

[00:08:50] just a bad you know so that was that was another one of my questions for you is that because you’ve made a really big

[00:08:56] part of your focus is on debunking evolution um do you think that Evolution and the

[00:09:02] idea of evolution is the main cause of atheism or the spread of the nuns and

[00:09:08] agnosticism just people saying boy I just don’t know what to to what to think anymore I mean we’ve got Evolution here

[00:09:14] how do I how do I fit that with the Bible is that the main thing that’s driving for a lot of people that’s driving their atheism or their lack of

[00:09:21] belief uh it’s it’s a biggie and I think there’s two things for the non-believers yes they’re getting Evolution it might

[00:09:28] not be the main but it’s up there in the top three but also with Christians when they start hearing this you know uh the

[00:09:36] the age of the universe and I have a lot of friends who disagree with me uh that’s all right um they start hearing

[00:09:42] this and they they they know Genesis chapter one and they start going well if Genesis chapter 1 isn’t accurate and

[00:09:49] literal and we can’t abide by that well then I’m gonna you know who cares about Christianity and the rest of the Bible

[00:09:55] in general so it’s happening evolution is affecting both non-believers and

[00:10:00] Believers which is for 40 years the piltown man and all of these uh fake

[00:10:08] missing links affected Society to the point where Christians started coming up with things like Progressive creationism

[00:10:16] and theistic evolution and then the mud was on their face later when we realized all those

[00:10:23] were fakes literally all of them yeah no exception they were all fake and so that for over 40 years characterized our

[00:10:31] society and we’re still feeling the effects of this today it’s amazing people on campus we talk to they just go

[00:10:37] well it’s just it’s it’s fact and uh we say well um it isn’t actually fact uh

[00:10:45] it’s just you know over the last hundred years the scientific Community has blindly pursued an evolutionary agenda

[00:10:52] rather than scientific truth that’s the bottom line yeah absolutely and for those of you listening um one of my

[00:10:58] favorite books on on this is H bones of contention it’s a very pretty recent U uh book that was published and they

[00:11:05] examine almost every single Missing Link quote missing link that has ever been

[00:11:10] found and discovered and they specifically quote um those who adhere

[00:11:16] to Evolution so they they’re not they’re they’re taking those who adhere to

[00:11:21] Evolution and they’re using their quotes to say here’s where they’re falling and pretty much everybody is contentious

[00:11:26] over the issue it’s not as if there’s some Universal agreement that Evolution works or something there it’s act

[00:11:32] actually completely falling apart to the point where they that that um what you’ve got in your background there with

[00:11:38] the um you know chimp like ancestor on up the line has actually fallen on Hard

[00:11:44] Times people have said no no no we we don’t even have any kind of sequence of evolutionary progression that we even

[00:11:50] know of and and that’s coming from evolutionary scientists which is crazy so but yeah darwinian evolution

[00:11:59] uh it’s not based on known scientific laws or evidence but rather on false assumptions

[00:12:06] and poor science I mean there’s just no other way to slice it that that’s that’s what it is and when we talk to people on

[00:12:12] a campus or when I’m teaching uh students online we try to get them to understand that because they’re going to

[00:12:18] have very smart intelligent people trying to convince them otherwise and the reason is they hate

[00:12:25] the idea of a Timeless spasis IM material being God they they hate the

[00:12:31] idea of that so they they’re grasping onto something that’s absolutely uh ridiculous when when the truth is um

[00:12:39] that you know scientists secular scientists mostly maintain that evolution is a science and creation is a

[00:12:46] religion but the fact is evolution isn’t even testable using empirical analysis

[00:12:52] yeah and therefore it doesn’t even meet the definition of science um and it also doesn’t meet the definition of evolution

[00:12:59] AR Theory because that’s based upon observation and hypothesis well you don’t observe that and so it’s really an

[00:13:06] educated guess based upon uh you know observation um it’s it’s unsubstantiated

[00:13:13] really the bottom line is that Evolution uh has never been observed or

[00:13:19] proven by empirical science it’s just assumed to be true so evolution is not science it’s not Theory it’s at best an

[00:13:28] unsubstantial iated hypothesis and Professor Lou Bourne one time said um

[00:13:34] evolution is a fairy tale for grown-ups this theory has helped nothing in the progress of science it is useless and I

[00:13:41] agree with him absolutely yeah uh Noel Professor sir erns chain um he’s the guy

[00:13:47] that discovered the the effects of penicillin actually said it’s a h hypothesis based on zero evidence and um

[00:13:55] it’s stunning how much ground has been made with it um and I think it’s a leap of desperation it’s oh my gosh something

[00:14:02] that we can cling on to other than the idea that God created everything because really that’s the only two Alternatives

[00:14:07] right I mean you’ve e either got to to somehow come up with some secular

[00:14:12] explanation for why we exist or you’ve got to believe in God so I I was at a

[00:14:18] coffee shop and and I I pointed this out to a guy he said no no no there’s a third option and I I said really what

[00:14:24] what is it he thought for a minute and he go was you know I can’t think of one

[00:14:30] but I’m sure there’s one I just said no there isn’t that’s why you it yeah

[00:14:35] aliens but then you’ve got to explain where the aliens came from that’s right that’s right you have the same problem because isn’t it interesting is that

[00:14:42] people try to grab something that is based upon an intelligent designer aliens yeah you’re going isn’t

[00:14:50] that interesting because you just positive you just it bolstered my argument if it’s aliens the reason

[00:14:58] you’re thinking that is because you know intuitively that it has to be some type of um intelligent being yeah because you

[00:15:06] can’t you can’t give what you ain’t got nobody Tri tries to explain the Pyramids by saying uh nothing made it all it it

[00:15:14] made itself nobody tries to do that it’s always aliens right but the evolutionist is actually claiming that it all came

[00:15:20] from Nothing by itself so that so I’m sorry the atheist is saying it all came

[00:15:25] from nothing and um it all made itself with with no purpose or design or anything which is what they don’t what

[00:15:32] they don’t understand is that you can’t give what you ain’t got using you know poor grammar but it it works U so in the

[00:15:39] primordial soup of the past where we went from uh you know molecules and

[00:15:44] microbes to microbiologists or from fish to fishermen or from goo to UVA the zoo

[00:15:50] um in and you can’t get Consciousness from non-c

[00:15:57] consciousness and ju just as simple as that well let’s give it more time let’s

[00:16:02] give it several billion more years time doesn’t help them at all you know it’s like dropping it’s like cutting up an

[00:16:10] American flag into hundreds of pieces and dropping it over a football field from a helicopter and what’s the chances

[00:16:16] of forming into the flag again on the ground not good well let’s give it more time and distance we’ll go 10,000 feet

[00:16:23] we’ll drop it now did that help time doesn’t help the situation because just

[00:16:29] by just by definition evolution cancels itself out because evolution is the

[00:16:34] survival of the fittest so as a system is evolving the items or the the things

[00:16:41] on it that don’t work uh are eliminated and that’s how that is

[00:16:47] supposed to evolve and I’m saying it in real simple terms here so therefore it

[00:16:52] cancels itself out because as that system hasn’t grown that that creature whatever it is it hasn’t started

[00:16:59] evolving a central nervous system yet right well so it starts to evolve a

[00:17:04] central nervous system it’s hard to say this with a straight face as it starts to evolve a central nervous system

[00:17:11] Evolution goes well that’s not working and evolution will filter that out so

[00:17:16] evolution by its very definition does not work because it cancels itself out yeah because anything

[00:17:23] that is not immediately put to use is discarded um I I was talking to Dr James

[00:17:29] Tor he’s one of the top 50 scientists in the world and he actually said time is the enemy of evolution he said any

[00:17:35] research scientist knows that because you have a specimen that you’re trying to keep in perfect condition under the

[00:17:41] perfect temperatures in exactly the the right environment and be and it’s breaking down as you’re trying to

[00:17:47] utilize it and you want to add in millions and billions of years are you kidding me you you’re just talking about

[00:17:52] complete disintegration of anything that that is remotely uh connected to living

[00:17:58] organisms well not only time but fossils yeah there you go that’s I got tired of

[00:18:06] talking about fossils over the years and so I said you know what I’m gonna start digging my own so in Albuquerque and

[00:18:12] Texas and some other places I started going to different places in the mountains and digging my own

[00:18:18] fossils and it was amazing because I’d be down in The Valleys of Texas and up

[00:18:24] at the 10,000 foot range of the Sandia Mountains and I would find the same sea

[00:18:30] life and and many other things as well one of my favorites you can’t see it very well but this is a bug it’s a

[00:18:36] fossilized bug uh and so I would be holding in my hands like this one this I

[00:18:44] dug this in Texas I’d be holding in my hand something that had not been seen

[00:18:49] and was formed most likely by the noic flood because it’s at the top of the

[00:18:55] 10,000 foot range and out in The Valleys now that’s not proof positive by itself

[00:19:00] that’s just one in the Pyramid of of proofs yeah that’s awesome yeah and um

[00:19:06] so so kind of changing course a little bit you know I was um recently The

[00:19:11] Washington Post published a article um by a a columnist named Kate

[00:19:19] Cohan this was on October 3 and the title of her article is America doesn’t

[00:19:24] need more God it needs more atheists and um yeah right and so this is what she

[00:19:31] says which I thought was really uh interesting she says my children know how to distinguish fact from fiction

[00:19:37] which is harder for children raised religious they don’t assume conventional wisdom is true and they do expect

[00:19:43] arguments to be based on evidence which means they have the skills to be engaged informed and Savvy citizens she says we

[00:19:50] need citizens like that we need Americans who demand as atheists do that truth claims be Tethered to fact we need

[00:19:57] Americans who understand it a as atheists do that the future of the world is in our hands and in this particular

[00:20:02] political moment we need Americans to stand up to Christian nationalists who are using their growing political and judicial power to take away our rights

[00:20:10] atheists can do that and uh I just thought that was so ironic it’s it’s very ironic yes because

[00:20:19] for so many reasons but uh you know atheism is the belief which atheism is

[00:20:26] impossible you haven’t checked every in the universe or in the planet to see if there’s a God there at very best you

[00:20:33] could be a non-theist but you can’t be an atheists and I’ve had atheists say

[00:20:38] well you can’t prove there is a God and I go well so we at an impath so you just admitted that you can’t be an atheist is

[00:20:44] that what you’re telling me because ironically if atheism were true then people can’t think what they want

[00:20:51] because their thoughts are merely the necessary result of chemical reactions

[00:20:57] in the brain they think we’re vibrating Stardust they’re called naturalists all there is is nature well interestingly

[00:21:04] that lady can’t make those thoughts on her own unless there is a God she’s stealing from God because people can’t

[00:21:11] think what they they want it their their thoughts are just results of chemicals in the brain but only in a Christian

[00:21:17] worldview can we account for human freedom and rationality because in a Christian

[00:21:23] worldview people are more than just vibrating collect of atoms and so it’s

[00:21:30] clear that the Bible can’t be proved wrong in order to prove something you need laws of logic so she was trying to

[00:21:37] use laws of logic where do the laws of logic come from laws of logic presuppose

[00:21:44] a lawgiver we didn’t make up the laws of logic and so so uh atheism uh is very

[00:21:52] interesting and it is so self-defeating because um they think that the world is

[00:21:58] is just uh uh senseless well so for that matter then

[00:22:04] why would they be against Christianity if if there is no God then

[00:22:10] let Christians do what Christians do um because if there is no God why do anything at all yeah and yeah I mean it

[00:22:18] it it it’s standing on the coat Tales of Christianity to justify its positions about reality but but um for those of

[00:22:25] you uh tuning in my guest today is Larry BL he’s a a professor and teacher at apologia live online um if you’re

[00:22:33] interested in learning more about the defense of Christianity and digging deeper on these issues and really being

[00:22:38] able to dialogue with the people around you and have an impact I highly recommend you look at their classes

[00:22:43] apologia.com It’s a Wonderful opportunity to really grow in your faith and learn from people that have really

[00:22:49] studied and taught this for a long time um so Larry um I I wanted to throw this

[00:22:55] out there too because a lot of people will say you know um do you think you’re spending too much

[00:23:00] time with Evolution when you know obviously in the news we’re dealing with all this stuff that tragically has

[00:23:06] happened in Israel and what’s going on with um Hamas and Islam and some people

[00:23:12] might say well do you think that you should be spending more time dealing with issues like Islam versus dealing

[00:23:19] with issues like Evolution which is the greater um I don’t know if if threat is the right word but which is which is

[00:23:27] most hostile to uh Christianity and to people’s salvation uh is it more Islam

[00:23:34] in your opinion or is it more um atheism and evolution what are your thoughts uh

[00:23:39] it has to be all the above I mean we have to be multitaskers um because not only do we

[00:23:46] have to understand uh the world view but we need to understand world religions as

[00:23:52] well and we need to understand uh part of part of my uh studies in a seminary

[00:23:59] we had Islamic Studies and so I had to read the entire Quran and we learned from a Christian

[00:24:08] who’s a former Muslim and there there are just so many things

[00:24:14] that we can connect on but we often don’t so yes number one we have to learn

[00:24:21] how to um effectively speak with Muslims but also all the others that we’ve been

[00:24:27] talking about so people often isolate one or the others one or the other

[00:24:32] topics or issues and we need to try to do as many of those as we can but it’s

[00:24:39] okay if people say well I want to specialize in something because in an army uh you have to have different types

[00:24:47] of people doing different things so it can’t be somebody says you’re doing too much uh Evolution uh uh creation against

[00:24:56] darwinian evolution and you know I just I like my brother says well I like the

[00:25:01] way I’m doing it better than the way you’re not yeah you know because chances

[00:25:07] are they really aren’t doing anything so if they want to specialize in something else other than I am fantastic I’m all

[00:25:13] for it I mean for many many years in my youth ministry in California Northern California um I witnessed to Jehovah’s

[00:25:21] Witnesses all the time um probably 50 to

[00:25:26] 100 a year and had a Ministry to them and so then also to to Mormonism uh

[00:25:33] which is a polytheistic religion and so you know I’ve done all of those things

[00:25:39] and people don’t Christians don’t have to do all of that but pick something if they want to be experts in

[00:25:47] Islam do it do it yeah yeah absolutely so um yeah because you know some people

[00:25:54] will say they’ll say things like religion is the cause of all the wars you know if we didn’t have religion then we wouldn’t have these problems um and

[00:26:00] so even this lady right she’s saying we need more atheists and she’s looking at it and saying look it I I even had a guy

[00:26:07] I thought this was really interesting I was having this talk with this atheist one time and I asked him why did you decide not to be not to believe in um in

[00:26:15] God and he says well one of my best friends growing up was a Christian and

[00:26:21] then he began to tell me about Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon and I said whoa whoa whoa whoa wait a second you’re

[00:26:28] saying your best friend was a Mormon he goes yeah a Christian and I I said oh

[00:26:33] and so I sometimes I feel like people atheists somehow lump it all together

[00:26:38] and then go see religion is the problem it’s not based on fact there’s no

[00:26:43] evidence whatever the case um do you do you find in your discussions with people

[00:26:48] that there’s this confusion or just lack of knowledge about the evidencebased

[00:26:54] views of Christianity compared to things like Islam and Mormonism when you talk to to people on campus and other places

[00:27:01] is that something that’s an issue that people just are not aware that Christianity has so much evidence for it

[00:27:06] oh absolutely God gave us many infallible proofs and the attack on the

[00:27:12] scripture is on purpose and it’s very very smart by the evil one it’s very smart why because this is a historical

[00:27:21] document now we believe also that it’s inspired but it’s a historical document

[00:27:27] that documents everything from the first six days of creation but also documents

[00:27:33] all of history and how we deal with people so there there is

[00:27:41] no historical accuracy in the Book of Mormon the pearl of great price or the

[00:27:46] doctrine covenants their three books there is there is very little accurate

[00:27:51] history in the Quran in fact the Quran is mostly

[00:27:56] unintelligible uh um one in four verses and I’m I’m only stating this from fact

[00:28:02] yeah it’s not meant to um to make uh Muslims mad but if I sat down and talked

[00:28:09] with them about this they would say yeah I’m not sure what that means yeah yeah I’m not sure what that means yeah I’m

[00:28:15] not sure what that means so these are unintelligible books but as I read the

[00:28:21] uh books of and I I have a huge library of Jehovah’s Witness books of Mormon

[00:28:26] books of of Islamic books um when I read those to in order to be a better witness

[00:28:35] uh it’s almost like I’m reading the same author I mean the Bhagavad gas the the

[00:28:41] the Hindu books it’s sometimes it makes me go whoa this is kind of creepy it’s

[00:28:46] the same mind the same author and that is Satan himself and so people are deceived by that and they don’t

[00:28:53] understand the the excellent evidence uh uh for the scripture for its historicity

[00:29:01] for its accuracy for its text and the books that have been written about it have just been badly uh debunked and it

[00:29:08] was I think it was Christopher Hitchens The Atheist the the late Christopher Hitchens who said uh religion poisons

[00:29:15] everything like the lady you mentioned yeah no no no we say everything poisons

[00:29:22] religion that’s what’s going on everything poisons religion religion doesn’t poison everything so the lady

[00:29:28] that you mentioned who made this statement about atheism what would she think if you went up then and uh you

[00:29:36] know uh shot her or or beat her kids up would she protest to that or would she

[00:29:42] say well you’ve got a right to whatever you want to do because see their

[00:29:48] worldview does not match that to say uh we should have more atheists is is

[00:29:54] ridiculous because she can’t live that life if if she’s being kind why is she being kind where is she getting her idea

[00:30:00] of morality and that’s where we get into apologetics uh I love the argument for

[00:30:05] the existence of God using the moral law and so that’s what I would do with the lady you mentioned is I would start

[00:30:11] going into the moral law well why do you think that that’s good to have more

[00:30:17] atheists rather than Christians and you start trapping her into saying good and better and best and all that you go

[00:30:22] where are you getting those ideas of good and better and best oh well we’ve learn through Society well what was

[00:30:29] Society basing that on you can’t make the statements like she made without

[00:30:36] appealing to a Timeless spaces immaterial being god of the universe and and that’s just that’s just

[00:30:43] the bottom line yeah atheism is just incredibly inconsistent um and what I’ve noticed in my own discussions with

[00:30:50] atheists is that they just are completely unaware of their their own inconsistencies um most of them have not

[00:30:56] taken the time to actually uh dig a little deeper than just these surface cliche arguments to realize whoa

[00:31:03] wait a second I’m I’m uh I’m standing in in midair here I’m not I have no

[00:31:08] foundation for anything that I’m actually saying um and and so um Greg

[00:31:13] kok has a book on that feet uh firmly planted in midair or or is it buvi yeah I think it’s kok yeah I think

[00:31:21] it’s Coco feet firmly planted in midair yeah pry pretty funny yeah yeah that’s

[00:31:26] right I mean you know and and I would tell somebody like that too you know uh that uh there are really three things

[00:31:34] number one a rational person must have justification for what he believes or

[00:31:39] she and acts upon uh he that he or she has to have a

[00:31:45] reason because then with Logic No one’s allowed to be arbitrary then number two

[00:31:50] only the Christian worldview provides a reason to believe that the future will be like the past which the atheist would

[00:31:57] uh agree with only the Christian has justification for the uniformity of

[00:32:03] nature upon which all science depends so therefore when non-christians do science

[00:32:10] like this lady would say and I’m sure she would say that science is all that I believe in they’re being irrational

[00:32:16] because they believe in something uniformity that they have no

[00:32:22] justification so uh the the evidence is always consistent with Biblical uh

[00:32:28] creation yeah it’s incredible I was talking to an atheist once and um I I

[00:32:34] said she she was accusing me of not believing in science and having faith yes and I said I said well I don’t

[00:32:41] know if you realize it but you have faith too and she said what do you mean and I said well you have faith that your

[00:32:47] your brain is actually reliable and yet you believe it it evolved with no purpose to it and how can you even

[00:32:54] justify that you can trust your own brain and I said it’s circular reasoning to say I trust my brain because I trust my

[00:33:01] brain right and so you you actually have yeah you actually have no Foundation you’re putting your faith essentially in

[00:33:10] a claim that you have no evidence for and this kind of blew her her mind she was like whoa I’ve never thought about

[00:33:17] that before and I said yeah the difference between you and me is you have faith that nothing made everything and I have faith that God made

[00:33:24] everything so I have a reason to believe that things are rational because it was by a rational mind you have faith that

[00:33:29] nothing made everything therefore you’re putting your faith in your mind which you have no reason to believe is rational and so um I if there is if

[00:33:36] there is no God why is there something rather than nothing at all so and and

[00:33:42] and if the universe is merely just a Mindless accident why would we expect it

[00:33:48] to be orderly and to obey mathematical laws right yeah yeah why should I expect

[00:33:53] my senses my brain to reliably inform my mind like you were saying which I think

[00:33:59] you nailed it if both are simply the results of mutations that conveyed some

[00:34:04] sort of survival you know value in the past there would be no reason to think

[00:34:09] that science is even possible in that kind of universe yeah on the other hand the biblical worldview makes complete

[00:34:17] sense of science so the way in which we do science requires us to know something

[00:34:22] about how the universe came to be and they don’t know how it came to be except by explosion which then gets into a lot

[00:34:29] of other areas they made a mistake coming up with a Big Bang Theory uh oh

[00:34:34] yeah that’s crazy too um well again for those of you listening apologia.com my

[00:34:39] guest is Larry BL um I I really encourage you to check out what they’re doing uh with his ministry and his

[00:34:46] organization um it’s absolutely fantastic and it’s so necessary as a Christian today because um in the past

[00:34:52] you could almost live passively because people weren’t out and about just attacking Christianity but today it’s

[00:34:58] not the case anymore and the amount of um really bad ideas that are out there

[00:35:03] on social media um all over things like Tik Tok and and um Instagram and

[00:35:09] wherever it’s stunning to me um I was watching a live just the other day um on

[00:35:15] Tik Tok where a guy was arguing um he was arguing that the Bible teaches that

[00:35:20] slavery is okay which is just another one of these things where if you if you haven’t taken the time to actually in it

[00:35:27] what he posted up could be very confusing um but you have to take the time to look into it I really encourage

[00:35:33] you as a Christian um you need to take the time to really study why you know the Bible is true and to be able to give

[00:35:39] a good defense um Larry I know that um you and your brother both were visiting

[00:35:45] college campuses for quite a while and um I don’t know how much you do this if you do this as often anymore but um

[00:35:53] would you say that for somebody starting out they’re interested in apologetics is it a fruitful Ministry to actually go to

[00:36:00] college campuses and then you know take the opportunity to make discussion with

[00:36:05] people is that worthwhile or is that just um a bunch of arguing that gets nowhere what are your thoughts on that I

[00:36:12] think it’s very powerful number one my brother does that all the time I used to help him when I was in California but uh

[00:36:19] he is on college campuses just about every other week with his team but they’re

[00:36:24] trained and then also Al a former associate of Greg kok’s Brett kungle

[00:36:31] also does that and he trains students uh for example one of the ones I love he

[00:36:36] trains students for a long time on how to witness to Mormons uh the Church of Jesus Christ of

[00:36:43] latterday saints of which is none of those um and uh he then takes them right

[00:36:50] into Salt Lake City and so those are very powerful you have the way of the

[00:36:55] master uh and they go out on the street and witness to people and my brother not

[00:37:01] only sees people come to and his is a pro-life ministry that’s his springboard

[00:37:06] but it’s a uh gospel pro-life Ministry they’re not out there just to save

[00:37:12] babies just like we’re not out there just to win an argument yeah uh we the

[00:37:17] the purpose of winning an argument is not primary but our purpose is to get

[00:37:23] the gospel in and it’s amazing to watch when you talk to people and they think

[00:37:28] their their preconceived ideas that Christians are a bunch of idiots and then when you ask them just a few key

[00:37:35] questions and you start dialoguing properly and properly I’m referring to the book tactics by Greg

[00:37:42] kokal um because he’s one of us apologists and he finally said hey enough guys we’ve got to organize this

[00:37:49] and so he’s speaking to us in that in that book right because we forgot first Peter 3:15 the last part that says um

[00:37:56] you know be ready always to give an answer but do it do it with gentleness and respect yeah go oops so so when My

[00:38:05] Brother Talks to people and they come up and they use self-defeating statements all the time they’ll come running up to him and I won’t steal all of his Thunder

[00:38:12] because I know you’re gonna have him later uh and they’ll say why are you on this campus you can’t be coming here sharing your ideas with people on this

[00:38:18] campus and he goes wait a minute didn’t you just come run up and share your views with people on campus to tell me I

[00:38:25] can’t share my views and after a while it sounds good you know oh wow he really stopped that

[00:38:31] argument there’s a purpose and that is and you watch and I show videos to my

[00:38:36] classes of him because they video everything that in 10 15 20 minutes 30 minutes sometimes those students end up

[00:38:42] shaking their hands and thanking my brother and his team and walking away

[00:38:48] with a book a track whatever at first they were violent yeah but then all of a

[00:38:53] sudden they’re hit with this intellectual

[00:38:58] um uh bomb and all a sudden they realize that they’ve been deceived and they’re

[00:39:05] Echo Chambers they don’t know anything all they’re doing is echoing something to that they’ve heard in class my

[00:39:12] brother and I were at the University of the Pacific in California a few years ago and a student came up and I was wearing my hat and finally a student

[00:39:19] came up and he was you know snickering and I said oh we’ve been looking for somebody like you all day so you think

[00:39:26] that’s ridiculous yeah and so you think evolution is true and uh you think that

[00:39:31] uh we’re crazy yeah essentially and I said I’ve been waiting for you I said

[00:39:37] come on over here and I was real nice you know that’s how we are and then I said I put pin to paper uh you know uh

[00:39:44] not in reality I put my hand on my hand like I was gonna write and I said I want to know the Silver Bullet why

[00:39:51] Christianity and creation is ridiculous and evolution is true and he goes well

[00:39:56] that’s easy I’m a microbiologist major here and um and I

[00:40:01] said I’m ready and he said he said I said just just one I just want the Silver Bullet what’s the biggie what’s

[00:40:08] the thing you want to just Smash in my face like pie and he said um what do you

[00:40:13] think he said I’m guessing he said evolution is a fact well that’s what his foundation was

[00:40:20] but he said um bacteria oh yeah and I said bacteria I

[00:40:27] said John I’m not impressed what do you mean he goes well we look under the mic microscope and we study and we see this

[00:40:35] bacteria uh metaphorically essentially growing new parts and and uh basically

[00:40:41] evolving and and growing new things and I said I looked at him purposely kind of

[00:40:46] with a stare and I said wait a minute John that’s your proof yeah I go well I’ve got a question and the guy was way

[00:40:53] smarter than me but I said wait I’ve got a question question what is that bacteria

[00:41:00] now and he kind of stepped back and said uh well because he knew he just jumped

[00:41:06] right in you know he went down the funnel and he said he said well it’s bacteria and I said wait so your proof

[00:41:14] is that you watch bacteria evolve into bacteria like a human evolve into a

[00:41:20] human I said that’s not darwinian Evolution I asked for darwinian evolution a change of kind

[00:41:27] from a tomato to a tom cat from a fish to a fisherman and he said well you’re

[00:41:32] looking at only a 20 minute window over billions of years and I said wait a

[00:41:38] minute you accuse us of having faith that’s a lot more faith than I have you just said it could happen and that’s

[00:41:44] your proof and so we continued on and I use other illustrations the car that was next to us like he was saying look at

[00:41:51] this car like the bacteria the car is doing this and that and the other I said the big question is

[00:41:57] where did the car come from yeah and so he was visibly moved and at one point he

[00:42:03] just didn’t know what to say and my brother immediately jumped in and started sharing the gospel with him that’s awesome but that’s what happens

[00:42:11] when you’ve just done a little bit of of study and work and uh you learn these

[00:42:17] things if you want a pet thing that you learn and you can’t do all of that

[00:42:23] fantastic I’m all for it I’m game so so we’re we’re um coming up on the end of

[00:42:29] our time here together but um for the people that are listening that are like Oho I love this I love it they’re like

[00:42:35] so excited right they’re they’re like this is great this is right up my alley I feel like God is inspiring me this is

[00:42:42] the kind of stuff I want to get involved with how do they put um you know how do they they put feet to the pavement what

[00:42:49] do they do in order to get that ball rolling what is step one two three in in

[00:42:55] for that that kid maybe they’re 177 18 whatever 16 years old maybe they’re

[00:43:00] older maybe they’re in their their um late 20s they’re in their 30s and they’re at church and they want to start

[00:43:07] not just learning apologetics but they actually want to do something with it that actually makes an impact how do

[00:43:14] they start taking those steps I mean do they just jump right on the college campus or is there something they do

[00:43:20] before that in order to prepare themselves well they can but they need to take a lot of notes when they jump on there um uh I would say two things you

[00:43:27] need to read I don’t have enough Faith to being an atheist and and Frank and I differ just in one small area in here it

[00:43:33] doesn’t doesn’t matter it’s great we’re Seminary mates we love each other he’s just a great friend but this is a good a

[00:43:40] toz and there are other great books as well as you know um but also they need to get tactics by Greg kokal because he

[00:43:47] says we have to be in fact he calls it the Colo tactic we have to become more

[00:43:52] questioners thinking of the good questions because we want to jump right into it just like when you ask stuff today I jump right into

[00:43:59] it rather than saying one they Kevin what do you mean by that you

[00:44:04] know a different format right yeah yeah but I would say get I don’t have enough Faith being an atheist get um uh Greg

[00:44:12] hok’s book tactics another great one is Christianity for Skeptics and you really

[00:44:17] need to educate your mind and then go out and try it and you’ll get you’ll get

[00:44:23] beat up so to speak and that’s how you learn to say what should I have said my

[00:44:29] brother used to call me all the time I often joke that he got my Seminary education uh from the breadcrumbs over

[00:44:36] the years as they would call and say all right this guy in the campus said blah blah blah what should I do and so we would talk about it and we would

[00:44:43] strategize and well that’s a self they made a self-defeating statement um and

[00:44:48] there’s no such thing as truth really is that true and so once you learn that

[00:44:54] then you’ve got to go out and try it and get beat up many times uh until uh you

[00:44:59] know how to handle it the next time that objection comes up and Greg kok will help that so that would be that would be

[00:45:05] my all-time three favorite books and there’s many more um of course but those those are the three that that that we do

[00:45:12] and promote that is fantastic uh my guest today is Larry blly and he is H

[00:45:18] with apologia.com you can check that out um he’s got tons of resources and uh you

[00:45:24] can even have him as a teacher uh so Larry I just want to thank you so much for taking the time to be with us I

[00:45:29] think what you’re doing and your ministry is incredible so thank you very much well thank you I appreciate it very

[00:45:35] much and thank you for your ministry and your work yeah absolutely my website if you want to check it out is educate

[00:45:40] forlife.org there’s all kinds of homeschool curriculum on there also very you know apologetics oriented everything

[00:45:45] I do as apologetics I’m a full-time apologetics teacher as well and um I just W to um you know I am having

[00:45:53] Larry’s brother is coming on he like uh Larry was descri describing um he is an expert in the pro-life Ministry he’s on

[00:45:59] Cal uh C campuses in California um really um on the edge of of um Ministry

[00:46:06] there so we have all kinds of amazing shows coming up um scientific discoveries by creationist with Dr Olen

[00:46:12] Brown um is coming up um in October also I have a uh Jill Baker who is a tour

[00:46:20] guide in the British museum giving archaeological biblical tours over in Britain uh that’s going to be really

[00:46:26] encouraging we have a discussion of the age of the Earth with Dr Russ humph and then um Don will be with us he’s with at

[00:46:34] the well Ministries in November so I hope you can join us when we uh have

[00:46:39] these um I’d like to end um just by encouraging you um you know the best

[00:46:45] thing we can do we look all around us and sometimes it seems like the sky is falling but that is never the case God

[00:46:50] is always in control um the Bible teaches us whatever is good whatever is Holy whatever is pure think on the these

[00:46:56] things so keep your keep your eyes fixed on Christ don’t allow the environment and the waves to discourage you um

[00:47:02] because God is on our side and if he is for us then honestly nobody can be against us so uh thanks for being here

[00:47:09] this evening and I hope you have a fantastic week we’ll see you next time when you need tires or service count on

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[00:48:41] 619 222 0766 hi this is Jason Hall president of

[00:48:47] Team Home Loans a branch of synergy 1 lending I just want to take this opportunity to thank Kevin Conover for

[00:48:53] the profound impact he’s had on mine and my wife’s spiritual life as well as being an incredible teacher while our

[00:48:59] kids were his students his knowledge and passion have taught us all how important it is to be Defenders of our faith it’s

[00:49:04] our honor and privilege to support Kevin and his show it is our sincere hope and prayer that you will continue to learn

[00:49:10] to be Defenders of your faith through Kevin’s radio show and through his educate for Life teachings thank you

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